[11:16] <ccp_larrikin> @here so, with the PANIC module on the Rorq, should it block cynos on the Rorq (or on industrial ships it effects), or not, and why? [cc: focusgrouplogbot]
[11:18] <steveronuken> Nope. The point of the PANIC is to give you some time for backup to arrive. If Backup is a jump away, if you don't have something able to light the cyno, it's not going to arrive in time.
[11:18] <steveronuken> (imho :wink: )
[11:26] <jintaan> Can Rorqs use their PANIC to non-consensually lock people in position of you get, say, a spy Rorq into someone's corp?
[11:27] <ccp_larrikin> @jintaan anyone in fleet in an indy ship will be effected.
[11:27] <jintaan> Good... Good...
[11:28] <jintaan> And I think the cyno+invuln opens up a fair bit of potential abuse
[11:29] <jintaan> The more interesting question for me is can it boost while invuln?
[11:31] <titus.tallang> i think cynos should be allowed
[11:32] <titus.tallang> but only on the rorqual itself, possibly? not sure, but it would make it an extra commitment
[11:35] <titus.tallang> or maybe even make the PANIC itself a cyno? that can actually be a downside considering how it might bait unprepared friendly caps to filter into the meatgrinder
[11:35] <titus.tallang> and make it a systemwide beacon?
[11:36] <titus.tallang> just random ideas obviously, it's not my area of space
[11:36] <titus.tallang> but otherwise it feels like all you do is make mining ops have a spare covops or inty with a cyno
[11:43] <titus.tallang> heck, PANIC = alliance wide cynos, same as pos beacons? make it even more self-baity
[12:22] <ccp_fozzie> making it a cyno itself is something we've considered, yes
[12:22] <ccp_larrikin> @jintaan what potential abuse do you see above existing capital cynos?
[12:27] <jintaan> Jump in with a Rorq->PANIC->Cyno
[12:28] <jintaan> Invulnerable on-grid cyno
[12:28] <jintaan> Way better than a Carrier/HIC as is used currently
[12:30] <jintaan> (killing a cyno is rare, but it can dramatically shift a fight if you kill it before they can get the full fleet in. Plus this means you can drop it anywhere on grid w/ no worries about getting burnt down for 5 minutes)
[12:31] <jintaan> I don't know if you guys consider that an 'issue', but it's something that's a knee jerk response to me
[12:31] <jintaan> As in, if you can cyno with the panic up this will be used
[12:31] <jintaan> Don't know to what extent though.
[12:50] <scott_ormands> Fairly expensive ship to use as a hard cyno though
[12:51] <scott_ormands> If you want a hard cyno a fax would work almost as well and would actually contribute something to the fleet. Could also use a bling for DST as certain fits can get over 1 M ehp
[12:51] <scott_ormands> What is the range of the PANIC
[12:55] <ccp_larrikin> @jintaan at the largest scales a tanked Aeon is used for an in-cyno. Even at the medium scale, a well tanked Archon is going to last long enough to get your fleet on-grid. If your trying to jump into a bunch of trigger happy DDing titans, I can see a Rorq giving a destinct advantage, sure.
[12:56] <jintaan> Fair enough
[12:57] <jintaan> I was just raising it as a concern
[12:57] <jintaan> Regarding a fleet sitting on a Titan for any Indy fleet to cyno up I think that's cool
[13:07] <steveronuken> What's the duration of the panic button? I've seen some people say 5 minutes, but I've not seen a primary source for that?
[13:14] <ccp_fozzie> currently hammering out that number
[13:14] <ccp_fozzie> leaning towards 5 minutes base with a skill that increases it
[13:14] <ccp_fozzie> so that the attacker doesn't know the exact duration
[13:24] <steveronuken> Feels short to me. But that's a gut feel reaction
[13:36] <jintaan> Feels good to me
[13:37] <jintaan> Plenty of time to flash form a militia
[13:37] <jintaan> Well, plenty of time to take a small roam/camping fleet to the location
[13:37] <jintaan> Whilst not giving you 30 minutes to form a hard counter
[15:19] <titus.tallang> imo duration should show as a timer on the rorq bracket
[15:20] <titus.tallang> same as RF on depots or polarization on wormholes
[15:20] <titus.tallang> so once it's active you know how long it'll last
[15:22] <titus.tallang> apart from that between 5 and 10 min sounds fine
[15:22] <titus.tallang> sitting there 30 minutes to kill a rorqual even if it doesn't bring any friends sounds like very boring gameplay
[15:22] <titus.tallang> also, battle rorquals using PANIC is a concern maybe
[15:23] <titus.tallang> maybe let infinite points disable it? so if a hic lands on grid they are forced to either PANIC now or never
[15:27] <titus.tallang> otherwise anyone with local superiority can go "here's my rorqual, I'll play with you a bit and see what I kill, but if you actually manage to get me low I'll just panic and ping my corp to log on stuff"