[13:58] <progodlegend> @caprisunkraftfoods is this Pyfa file out yet for this? I tried to do some fits by hand but I got two done and decided I wanted to kill myself
[13:58] <progodlegend> I don't want to make any comments before I actually get the chance to break these things in EFT
[14:38] <ccp_fozzie> either way the plan is for you to be able to use ghost fitting on sisi later this week
[14:48] <white0rchid> That'd be great
[14:49] <white0rchid> I'm waiting to make some fits either in game or on pyfa as @progodlegend said, it's painful doing it by hand
[14:51] <caprisunkraftfoods> Fozzie if thats the case blitz will probably just wait then since its a lot less effort to extract the data from pyfa
[14:53] <ccp_fozzie> Yup the plan is for the July release to hit sisi in the second half of this week
[15:14] <caprisunkraftfoods> I can tell you're hedging there, what would delsy it?
[15:15] <caprisunkraftfoods> Honestly don't mind, just I know a lot of people reading these logs hate checking it multiple times a day for days only to find nothing :p
[15:17] <icarus_narcissus> Also, @ccp_fozzie do we have an estimated time for the industrial changes?
[16:17] <ccp_fozzie> @caprisunkraftfoods I hedge on everything :slightly_smiling_face:
[16:17] <ccp_fozzie> things that would delay it would be stuff like broken builds or an asteroid hitting the data center with sisi
[18:15] <caprisunkraftfoods> Nice i hope that last one doesn't happen
[18:20] <exooki> well, with the rorqual nerfs, our ability to combat the roid menace IS diminished
[18:23] <rowells> Don't worry, we've got four hours to prepare for the next one
[18:24] <rowells> When you're calculating effective turrets, does RoF count the same as a damage bonus?
[18:26] <mawderator> (total number of physical turrets * (1 + damage modification)) / (1 - rate of fire) = effective turrets
[18:27] <rowells> Oh damn there's a formula
[18:46] <icarus_narcissus> It's Eve, there's always a formula :wink:
[18:51] <sturm_gewehr> Maybe should make mining subsystem to protect sisi
[18:51] <rowells> I second that
[18:51] <rowells> Drone bonus on proteus let's do this
[18:51] <icarus_narcissus> I think the far more reponsible option is a 5th Tech 3 Cruiser by ORE/Upwell
[18:52] <sturm_gewehr> I actually really like mining subsystem idea in theory, for like high risk covops mining of specialized ores that are rare/hard to find with smaller yields.
[18:53] <sturm_gewehr> Sounds a bit challenging to pull it off well though, especially between now and patch.
[18:53] <icarus_narcissus> We do what we must to protect sisi from the asteroid menace!
[18:55] <sturm_gewehr> If you did it on the empire t3s you could have people bring the subs during strat ops and start mining in enemy space if they are blueballing, ultimate BM?
[18:56] <icarus_narcissus> I think that we should stop talking about this before the people who read the chat logs think we are serious...
[18:58] <sturm_gewehr> Or before I start to like it too much and advocate for it seriously, way too amused by the idea...
[19:01] <exooki> it might make more sense once moon goo is a minable roid
[19:01] <exooki> i know we were mostly joking, but i doubt any mining out there atm is worth enough to justify a t3C
[19:01] <exooki> especialyl since theyre getting more expensive
[19:01] <icarus_narcissus> I'll say this on the record, as a lore geek and as an industrialist -- I would be absolutely pleased if CCP came out with some new Upwell/ORE hulls in the future, especially with the refineries comining out. That said, it's beyond the scope of this conversation and I'm stopping now. (Although a mining bonus on the Proteus could result in some funny killmails)
[19:45] <sturm_gewehr> "Proteus Offensive - Drone Synthesis Projector - +175m3 Drone Bay"
[19:45] <sturm_gewehr> Is this the accurate number?
[19:46] <sturm_gewehr> @ccp_fozzie
[19:50] <ccp_fozzie> that's correct for this version
[19:50] <ccp_fozzie> I assume you think it should be higher?
[19:51] <sturm_gewehr> yes
[19:51] <ccp_fozzie> definitely something to consider
[19:51] <sturm_gewehr> you get a single full flight of heavy/sentry drones
[19:51] <sturm_gewehr> and by full I mean only 100mbit versus 125mbit of ishtar, vni, etc
[19:51] <sturm_gewehr> Stratios gets 100mbit but partially compensates with a big drone bay
[19:53] <sturm_gewehr> I think 200m3 bay should be the bare minimum, I think I would prefer 225m3 or 250m3 as the minimum though, this allows 2 flights of heavy/sentry and then at least 1 flight of lights for some flexibility, EC-300s, rep drones, lights to push off intys, etc.
[19:54] <sturm_gewehr> I don't think it needs stratios sized drone bay but I think it is currently pretty small for PvP, especially considering the price tag and SP loss.
[19:58] <sturm_gewehr> I think ~300m3 is a better sweet spot though, allows for 3 full flights of heavy/sentry which will be useful for sentry PvP fits, 2 full flights of heavy/sentry with some spare heavys, lights for clearing tackle, ewar drones, a few rep bots, etc.
[19:59] <sturm_gewehr> The sub in general seems incredibly underwhelming at the moment and I think this will be a good way to give it a leg up without making it incredibly overbearing in combat like old ishtars.
[20:02] <sturm_gewehr> Also, why no optimal bonus on the proteus drone sub?
[20:03] <sturm_gewehr> Either to just sentries or in general.
[20:16] <rowells> Wouldn't it be 2 reps + link + drones then?
[20:26] <sturm_gewehr> ?
[20:27] <rowells> I mean for the current proposal. 7 highs and 4 turrets
[20:28] <sturm_gewehr> For what though.
[20:28] <sturm_gewehr> The proteus support sub?
[20:28] <sturm_gewehr> +7H, +4 Turrets
[20:28] <sturm_gewehr> +100 capacitor capacity
[20:28] <sturm_gewehr> +50mbit Drone Bandwidth, +75m3 Drone Bay
[20:28] <sturm_gewehr> +1 max locked target
[20:29] <rowells> I think all of them have the same setup. Gotta double check the tengu drones tho
[20:29] <sturm_gewehr> Additional Stats:
[20:29] <sturm_gewehr> +7H, +4 Launchers
[20:30] <sturm_gewehr> +100 capacitor capacity
[20:30] <sturm_gewehr> +1 max locked target
[20:31] <rowells> Well I guess I'm asking what the damage needs to be at. Depending on how you combine/swap around reps and links
[20:33] <sturm_gewehr> On live right now to tradeoff for links is mostly tank, not damage.
[20:33] <sturm_gewehr> The turret loki, for example, is 9 effective turrets and a triple application bonus.
[20:34] <sturm_gewehr> The support subs are 4 effective turrets/launchers with 0 application bonuses.
[20:35] <rowells> Ah
[20:35] <sturm_gewehr> It is tricky right now with the support slot layout right now though.
[20:37] <sturm_gewehr> Ignoring the rr bonus, I think a fair power level for link/damage builds is 6-8 effective weapons with 1-2 application bonuses. But doing that on only 4 hardpoints and allowing "easy" triple link fits or RR/damage/link spider tanking fits with that damage could be too strong.
[20:41] <sturm_gewehr> I don't like the removal of link/damage as a viable option but not sure how to make that possible and coexist with the rr bonuses as well.